In the early days of New Mandala I made a number of posts about life in Bangkok. For interested readers, I have extracted the following passage from the archives (the full version is available here). This descriptive piece, titled “Drop it like it’s hot…”, was originally posted on 22 June 2006.
If any New Mandala readers can offer further insight - or their own analysis or anecdotes - I think everybody would learn a great deal.
Back in June 2006, I wrote:
For all of the foreign-authored books, articles and websites on Bangkok “at night”, I have rarely seen insightful things written about the Bangkok nightlife that my friends know best. Far from the notorious, and clichéd, flesh-pots of Sukhumwit, Ratchada and Silom, there is a nightlife that appeals to well-heeled (and not so well-heeled) Thai urbanites. Students, workers, wannabe socialites, anyone—they all like to party, and gravitate, when they can, towards the same style of venue. Almost everybody wants to get in to a big, expensive club, filled with imported hip-hop beats, copious amounts of Red Label (or something even better?) and tables that are placed on the dance floor.
During this week, and as part of my regime of hanging out with old friends, I went out to one of Bangkok’s most durable and popular “youth” entertainment areas. It is sizeable, with at least a dozen major clubs, each targeting a specific gradation of social status and spending power. Because my friends were particularly happy to have me back in town, we went to a place that under normal circumstances we would not visit. It is just a little bit too “hi-so”—too far from their (and my) humble origins, and the kind of place where some of them have even been refused entry in the past. “Face control”, where only the most appropriately dressed, gratuitously wealthy or sublimely attractive can gain entry, is a real part of this “other” Bangkok night scene. Bring your trendiest threads and at least a few thousand baht, if you really want to see the action for yourself.
…
In this club, and, in my experience, at all similar places, very little effort is made to meet new people or to mingle. The pre-formed groups arrive together and, for the most part, they leave together. They dance together and pour their drinks from the same bottle of whiskey. It is communal, in a way that is often ignored by Thai pundits of “community culture”. It is hierarchical, radically defensive, and intended, first and foremost, to keep the group together…around their whiskey.
How this form of night-clubbing has evolved, what it was like 10 or 20 years ago, or where it all began, are all questions that I would love to try to answer.
…
It seems reasonably obvious why these places (and their cultures) have been largely ignored by non-Thai writers. This still does not explain why young Thai anthropologists aren’t examining these venues and their lifestyles and communities. I have spent many hours over the past few days trawling all of my favourite bookshops and—while I see shelves of books on “the disenfranchised”, “the community” and “development”—I see nothing about new Thai social forms, and their marriage to past and future Bangkok. Am I missing something?
I would be delighted to hear comments from anybody with further insight about RCA, Ratchada Soi See, or the various other areas that continue to “boom” during Bangkok’s long, hot nights.
12 responses so far ↓
1 anon // Mar 20, 2007 at 6:43 am
… the kind of place where some of them have even been refused entry in the past. “Face control”, where only the most appropriately dressed, gratuitously wealthy or sublimely attractive can gain entry, is a real part of this “other” Bangkok night scene.
Is that really so? I’ve gone out in Bangkok for years, and the only places I’ve ever been refused entry are some hostess clubs on Silom (where only Japanese men may enter). I’m not particularly young, handsome, or well dressed, either.
Dance clubs frequented by the rich and beautiful (Santika, Q Bar, Bed, etc.), coyote clubs (Soprano, Forte, etc.), hostess clubs (Piano, Pent, etc.), and clubs targeted at college-aged kids (Ashley’s Rumor and the places in Liberty, Route and the places on RCA, Dance Fever and the places on Ratchada Soi 4) likewise never refuse entry. Although at some places, you might have to pay by the bottle.
How this form of night-clubbing has evolved, what it was like 10 or 20 years ago, or where it all began, are all questions that I would love to try to answer.
Not very different at all, although coyote bars didn’t exist back then. Before we had Santika, we had Taurus. Before we had Bed, we had NASA Spacedome. Piano seems to have been around forever.
If you go back further, it might be worthwhile to ask whether the idea of a hostess club came from China or Japan. The concept is very similar: you get drinks, conversastion, and maybe a kiss on the cheek - but never sex.
In this club, and, in my experience, at all similar places, very little effort is made to meet new people or to mingle. The pre-formed groups arrive together and, for the most part, they leave together.
No offense, but it seems as if you were surrounded by a bunch of people with low self-esteem. Although it’s not that common, it is possible to flirt and get to know people outside of your table. As long as you’re not a pig.
It seems reasonably obvious why these places (and their cultures) have been largely ignored by non-Thai writers.
For some reason, non-Thai writers seem obsessed with those dingy bar beers where they can get blowjobs in public. And those places where others do things with ping-pong balls that nature never intended.
2 Nicholas Farrelly // Mar 20, 2007 at 8:30 am
Thanks Anon,
1) At the place in question, I actually stood at the entry booth and watched people (not huge numbers, mind you) get turned away, on both that night and another night a few months later. Those turned away were an odd mix of foreigners inappropriately attired and people who didn’t “look” like they would be big-spenders. This place certainly refused entry and, on those nights, it was far from completely full. The entry policy seemed to be a half-hearted effort to manage the crowds, keep up profits and cultivate some kind of mystique.
Perhaps somebody who knows more about these kinds of clubs could offer some more analysis - I can only offer what I saw.
2) I don’t think that “low self-esteem” has anything to do with it. And it has much more to do with the structure, layout, and mentality of (some of) these clubs. No doubt there is inter-table mixing but it isn’t the same as one finds in the standard nightspots of many other cities.
But…I certainly don’t have all the answers and do appreciate the comments. As always, I welcome more ideas and insights.
Best wishes to all,
Nich
3 nganadeeleg // Mar 20, 2007 at 8:44 am
Nich, it’s not my scene really, but I wonder if the policies of, and behaviour at, these nightclubs are that much different to exclusive nightclubs for the ‘in’ crowd in other major cities around the world.
4 Pig Latin // Mar 20, 2007 at 10:35 am
Crowd management is often to do with controlling those in the “Feng Tau” (head shaking) movement I think… haha.
http://www.bedsupperclub.com/ Is this the sort of place you are referring too? As the club is seemingly quite elitist, wouldn’t an appropriate social etiquette apply?
From my perspective, the social maturity of newer-young people over the last 10-20 years (not that I am old, but I am affable) has decreased with more social restraints inhibiting self-determination to the point that few people are able to engage in conversation that would place them outside of their box (myspace profile).. especially with those that have something to loose (which I find elites often believe).
Whilst this interpretation is a sweeping generalisation, there are clubs in Causeway Bay, Hong Kong quite similar to what you have described.. and even taking into account the ‘new social constraints’ my opinion is that the club atmosphere is dictated by the people in it… and if people choose to go to a segregated bar with a selection policy in order to avoid “riff-raff” then this cannot really be said to be a new phenomenon in that there has always been elites in Thailand
This is probably far too simplistic in that I am not aware of Thai club culture so much… However, I feel that you are outlining a transnational situation…
Maybe someone from the Bullingdon Club (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bullingdon_Club) could offer more analysis!
ps.. sorry for the repeated submission!
5 anon // Mar 20, 2007 at 2:23 pm
- Most places will not let you in if you’re wearing flipflops. And shorts are usually frowned upon (unless if it’s a girl and she’s wearing short shorts). I’ve never been to a place that didn’t let me in wearing sneakers, jeans, and a t-shirt.
I’m not really sure what a “not big spender” looks like. In a place like Bangkok, you don’t have to spend that much in order to look nice. I’ve gone shopping with girls who spent 150 baht (50 for a tank top, 100 for a skirt) and still ended up looking like a million bucks.
- On busy nights, I get hit on like mad at 70’s Bar on Langsuan. But then again, 90% of the people on the floor there are either girls or gay. I do not look like a model.
But I understand what you’re saying, Nick. The whole “go with friends, get a table and a bottle, and dance around the table or dance with your friends on the floor”-thing puts some constraints on meeting up with new people.
The trick to having fun is making sure you invite the “right” group of friends. If everybody knows everybody else, that sort of makes things a bit boring, so it’s best to invite a bunch of people who might be meeting each other for the first time or might not know each other too well.
Another trick is to jam one group of friends with some other friends who just happen to be in the same club. The two groups mingle, and new friendships are made (or not).
And I’ve had very good results buying drinks for others. Not the whole western style “can I buy you a drink”-cliche. I’m talking about seeing a table full of nice girls, asking the waiter to send them a bottle of something nice, and then being ready if any sparks fly. This usually works best if one table is mostly full of guys and the other table is full of girls.
I’ve had very very good results getting lady friends at my table to help me hit on girls at other tables. This helps a lot.
If it’s pickup clubs that you’re looking for, I’m sure that they exist somewhere or another in Bangkok. But it’s Bangkok - I’ve never found the need to go to one.
- Bed Supper Club used to be fun, but these days is filled with sikh, farang, and expensive whores. Same with Q-Bar. It’s gotten to the point where I don’t want to bring lady friends there anymore.
6 Mike H // Mar 20, 2007 at 5:04 pm
A reason that there is not much research on these places is that cultural studies (and to a lesser extent sociology), two disciplines that have the tools to research them, are not widely taught at Thai universities.
The architecture of these places is different - no dance floor: I’ve heard this is because previously (1960s) dancing places were illegal, or needed a different license, but I’m not sure if this is true.
People gather around tables and not bars - because people always come in groups, part of the more communal culture, and also because normally one person pays for the whole table, part of the pervaisve hierarchy.
7 Phil // Mar 20, 2007 at 5:11 pm
People do get turned away, though the reasons are quite different from face (or more important: gender) controls in Europe.
Primary reasons are:
- No ID. Some clubs enforce a strict policy. Even if you look 35, if you don’t have an ID, you don’t get in. From what I heard clubs get fined in case they get checked and someone doesn’t have an ID (sufficient already, even though they might be old enough)
- Shorts or Sandals. The only clothing check that I have seen performed in “young” Bangkok nightlife are no open shoes and no shorts for men (no flipflops either). However, this is usually only the case in finer / dance venues.
Those observations are based on a broad range from clubs - from “working class” drink holes to “hiso” ones like Bed, Narcissus or Scirocco and maybe a 100 nights out in Bangkok (I guess I do enjoy nightlife). I got no idea about massage parlours / hostess clubs / etc. though.
Intoxitated? A guys only group? Harassment? I’ve seen that tolerated and unless it’s violence haven’t seen anyone getting kicked out.
Maybe the existence and acceptance of “massage parlours” make it less important for clubs to draw in girls, since guys are more likely to come in here than in the west if there are few girls. After all, they can and might get that somewhere else if they want.
A big dancefloor like in Europe? And who would be the self-confident people who are the first to dance in the middle of it (or the drunks, or the ones who linger around close to it with a beer in their hand…).
8 Srithanonchai // Mar 20, 2007 at 5:50 pm
“Shorts or Sandals. The only clothing check that I have seen performed in “young” Bangkok nightlife are no open shoes and no shorts for men (no flipflops either). However, this is usually only the case in finer / dance venues.”
So, these places then seem to have the same values as university libraries, where knowledge gathering also depends on your clothing.
9 Thai News // Mar 20, 2007 at 7:03 pm
“Shorts or Sandals not allowed.”
So it’s like any club in the world.
If you really want to wear shorts then you may try some
‘clubs’ in Samet, Samui or Phuket ;-p
10 Diego // Mar 20, 2007 at 9:20 pm
On the gay side of life, Peter Jackson’s scholarly work on gay issues in thailand touches on gay establishments in Bangkok especially Silom Soi 4 and Soi 2/1 in relation to queer identities. See: Jackson, P. 2003. “Gay capitals in global gay history: cities, local markets, and the origins of Bangkok’s same-sex culture,” in Postcolonial urbanism: Southeast Asian cities and global processes. Edited by R. Bishop, et al., pp. 151-66. New York: Routledge.
11 bangkoker // Mar 23, 2007 at 2:39 am
you all need to get out more…
Thai nightlife is significantly different sure. circling around a whiskey bottle with friends doesn’t stop one from meeting those at the next table.
besides, thais prefer to meet potential dates through friends.
finally, thais don’t really pick up girls as much as they pick up numbers.
a kway tiao meeting and an invitation to the next night out with the guy’s group finalizes the relationship.
12 Bangkok Neon - Chris Coles Gallery | All You Need To Know About Travel In Bangkok Thailand | Bangkok Travel // Jun 12, 2008 at 4:03 pm
[...] From the New Mandala archive: Bangkok at night past. Face control , where only the most appropriately dressed, gratuitously wealthy or sublimely attractive can gain entry, is a real part of this other Bangkok night [...]
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